James Cameron's AVATAR 2 - now playing in cinema theaters

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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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http://www.stltoday.com/blogzone/joes-m ... omment-569

Hahaha, this n00b wrote an article about the "new teaser" and posted a youtube of some fan-made piece-of-shit from 2007. Some other geeks and I yelled at him and he deleted the comments and re-wrote the article. It now says:
Disappointed readers immediately wrote me to say that it was simply a fan-made prank. (Some questioned the whereabouts of my journalism degree or a late-night fact-checker, and more than a few cussed me out. Such are the perils of journalism in the Internet era, when sites that rely on frequent updates become information compilers rather than gatherers. But Web publishing also let’s us quickly correct our mistakes.)
Web publishing apparently also let is us add apostrophes wherever we please.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Grammar nazi.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Streven Adler wrote:
thürstön.3®®0® wrote:
THE KILL wrote:I thought the next film he was going to do was the Gunm/ Battle Angel Alita trilogy.... :( :( :( :(
:what: :what: :what: :what: :what:

ok, i'm completely on board for this. it could be utter shit and i'm certain i'll still enjoy it.
it's never going to happen because he couldn't secure the rights from the original artist. instead, like with all of his other films, he took the original idea and changed it just enough to avoid legal troubles and made something completely different.

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and failed...
The first season of Dark Angel was pretty decent, but yeah, I'm sure Fox's pressure on the show as it progressed made it much, much worse. I'm positive that'll happen to Fringe next year once it gets weirder and people stop watching.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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from ComingSoon.net:

Steven Soderbergh was asked why he believes recent movies aren't impacting the culture as significantly as, say, THE GODFATHER did in 1972. After expressing his disappointment with the absence of "benchmark" movies, he cautioned that AVATAR might be the exception. His exact quote:

"I've seen some stuff and holy shit. It's the craziest shit ever. That could negate everything I just said."
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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I think this isn't that far off conceptually from Sleep Dealer. I haven't seen it yet, but I'm hoping it won't suck when I get to it.

I've always watched Cameron's films for merging crazy groundbreaking visual effects (minus Titanic - he did that to pay for a new house or something I guess) with a mediocre story anyway. If all you wanted out of a movie was a fantastic story, you'd be missing out on at least 60% of what makes movies different from a book. I'd think this would be obvious to people, but movies just aren't books and should be evaluated in their own way - compared to other movies, not to books. Almost all of classic science fiction literature is mental masturbation for geeks, so what's the big deal with a watered down version of the best handjob you ever got anyway?
EBA 64 wrote:It studies the ramifications of the impossible (or potentially possible) rather than simply telling a story involving things that don't exist like fucking Hobbits or whatever.
Pretty much. This is what separates sci-fi from fantasy - stuff that might actually have some relation to our current reality and one that's completely fabricated with its own rules and history. Alien species in Star Trek are all grounded in some sort of reality and as a relation to us humans while in most fantasy these alternate realities are often attempted to not be compared to us whatsoever. What unites them in the end are themes that we as thinking, feeling, struggling humans care for, not what, say, an alien's problems are. Anyone that attempted the latter in earnest is ultimately asking to fail to connect with any reader whatsoever and is basically crazy - might as well scream on the dust cover you're channeling the word of God.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Gookstorm wrote:I think this isn't that far off conceptually from Sleep Dealer. I haven't seen it yet, but I'm hoping it won't suck when I get to it.

I've always watched Cameron's films for merging crazy groundbreaking visual effects (minus Titanic - he did that to pay for a new house or something I guess) with a mediocre story anyway. If all you wanted out of a movie was a fantastic story, you'd be missing out on at least 60% of what makes movies different from a book. I'd think this would be obvious to people, but movies just aren't books and should be evaluated in their own way - compared to other movies, not to books. Almost all of classic science fiction literature is mental masturbation for geeks, so what's the big deal with a watered down version of the best handjob you ever got anyway?
EBA 64 wrote:It studies the ramifications of the impossible (or potentially possible) rather than simply telling a story involving things that don't exist like fucking Hobbits or whatever.
Pretty much. This is what separates sci-fi from fantasy - stuff that might actually have some relation to our current reality and one that's completely fabricated with its own rules and history. Alien species in Star Trek are all grounded in some sort of reality and as a relation to us humans while in most fantasy these alternate realities are often attempted to not be compared to us whatsoever. What unites them in the end are themes that we as thinking, feeling, struggling humans care for, not what, say, an alien's problems are. Anyone that attempted the latter in earnest is ultimately asking to fail to connect with any reader whatsoever and is basically crazy - might as well scream on the dust cover you're channeling the word of God.
Completely unrelated, but have you ever seen the show Party Down, on Starz? It's got Ken Marino from The State, that dude who played the douchey brother in Step Brothers, the old bitch from 40 Year Old Virgin, the hot chick from True Blood and Mean Girls (she was the goth chick in Mean Girls), and Martin Starr? Well, Martin Starr was hitting on some chick and telling her he was a sci-fi writer, and she was into him and started talking about Lord of the Rings, and he called her out because that's "fantasy, I'm hard sci-fi" and of course he blew his chance at getting laid. That's what your post reminded me of, even though it is very accurate in deciphering the two genres.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Gookstorm wrote:What unites them in the end are themes that we as thinking, feeling, struggling humans care for, not what, say, an alien's problems are. Anyone that attempted the latter in earnest is ultimately asking to fail to connect with any reader whatsoever and is basically crazy - might as well scream on the dust cover you're channeling the word of God.
Unless you completely humanize the aliens' problems, which is at once probably impossible not to do and also, a cheat?
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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godofdeadlydeath wrote:Completely unrelated, but have you ever seen the show Party Down, on Starz? It's got Ken Marino from The State, that dude who played the douchey brother in Step Brothers, the old bitch from 40 Year Old Virgin, the hot chick from True Blood and Mean Girls (she was the goth chick in Mean Girls), and Martin Starr? Well, Martin Starr was hitting on some chick and telling her he was a sci-fi writer, and she was into him and started talking about Lord of the Rings, and he called her out because that's "fantasy, I'm hard sci-fi" and of course he blew his chance at getting laid. That's what your post reminded me of, even though it is very accurate in deciphering the two genres.
I was watching Chelsea Lately last night and saw that scene with the dude talking about Lord of the Rings at a dinner date and she busted into Elvish in response. Is that the same show or what?

I don't really care that I go asperger's on shit like this, the lady is fine with that (just annoyed I go on tirades about meaningless stuff) and even argues with me on it sometimes. I doubt I ever ruined my chances with any girl because I'm a huge nerd.
MANTIS wrote:Unless you completely humanize the aliens' problems, which is at once probably impossible not to do and also, a cheat?
It's pretty impossible to not relate them to people in most stories, but you can treat them precisely like a biologist that has never been laid would and it wouldn't humanize them at all. If you start going into how their societies and shit work, you're in the ball park of nu-school science fiction where creatures like vampires, werewolves, and extra terrestrials are all "just like people, they want to be loved / accepted / blah blah" and other nonsense. I'm pretty tired of fantasy and sci-fi shit written for teenage girls to get engrossed in relationships that aren't their own because their own lives are so damn meaningless - this does not promote critical thinking or inspiration beyond shitty DeviantArt furry + anime + otherkin "artists." I'm tired of people like that buying so much of the shit, which motivates the publishers / studios to make more shit like it, which only results in more writing / movie-making of the same ilk and leaves less budget for movies that are higher risk.

But to be honest, most of science fiction is a nerd's version of societal / human condition commentary if you think about it. Much of Star Trek is about comparative species or something in the end (warning: I had a roommate that was a big Star Trek person - never liked or watched it) like how different alien civilizations have different values, family structures, and so forth and thus relates them back to us. I've never heard of a novel written from the perspective of an alien in full on alien language and everything. I dunno what that'd be... method 1st person writing or something?
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Good thoughts on what sci-fi really IS... I guess I'd be hard pressed to come up with a more exclusive definition than your seemingly-overly-inclusive one. I audiobook'd through a collection of sci-fi shorts recently and was disappointed with how many of them were just a typical story with different window-dressing. The standout was definitely Clarke's 9 Billion Names of God.
Gookstorm wrote:I was watching Chelsea Lately last night and saw that scene with the dude talking about Lord of the Rings at a dinner date and she busted into Elvish in response. Is that the same show or what?
I saw the same clip on CL - that's from an upcoming movie and the exchange was between Jan of The Office and short-shorts guy from Reno 9-11... who was also on The State with the Starr guy mentioned above but these are NOT the same clip. I think?
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Clarke is always a safe bet. Childhood's End motherfucker.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Fuck the story is REALLY short - check it out:
SPOILERSPOILER_SHOW
The Nine Billion Names of God

By Arthur Clarke

"This is a slightly unusual request," said Dr. Wagner, with what he hoped was commendable restraint. "As far as I know, it’s the first time anyone’s been asked to supply a Tibetan monastery with an automatic sequence computer. I don’t wish to be inquisitive, but I should hardly thought that your --ah-- establishment had much use for such a machine. Could you explain just what you intend to do with it?"



"Gladly," replied the lama, readjusting his silk robe and carefully putting away the slide rule he had been using for currency conversions. "Your Mark V computer can carry out any routine mathematical operation involving up to ten digits. However, for our work we are interested in letters, not numbers. As we wish you to modify the output circuits, the machine will be printing words, not columns of figures."



"I don’t understand . . ."



"This is a project on which we have been working for the last three centuries -- since the lamasery was founded, in fact. It is somewhat alien to your way of thought, so I hope you will listen with an open mind while I explain it."



"Naturally."



"It is really quite simple. We have been compiling a list which shall contain all the possible names of God."



"I beg your pardon?"



"We have reason to believe," continued the lama imperturbably, "that all such names can be written with not more than nine letters in an alphabet we have devised."



"And you have been doing this for three centuries?"



"Yes. We expected it would take us about fifteen thousand years to complete the task."



"Oh." Dr. Wagner looked a little dazed. "Now I see why you wanted to hire one of our machines. But exactly what is the purpose of this project?"



The lama hesitated for a fraction of a second, and Wagner wondered if he had offended him. If so, there was no trace of annoyance in the reply.



"Call it ritual, if you like, but it’s a fundamental part of our belief. All the many names of the Supreme Being -- God, Jehovah, Allah, and so on -- they are only man-made labels. There is a philosophical problem of some difficulty here, which I do not propose to discuss, but somewhere among all the possible combinations of letters, which can occur, are what one may call the real names of God. By systematic permutation of letters, we have been trying to list them all."



"I see. You’ve been starting at AAAAAAAAA . . . and working up to ZZZZZZZZZ . . ."



"Exactly -- though we use a special alphabet of our own. Modifying the electromatic typewriters to deal with this is, of course, trivial. A rather more interesting problem is that of devising suitable circuits to eliminate ridiculous combinations. For example, no letter must occur more than three times in succession."



"Three? Surely you mean two."



"Three is correct. I am afraid it would take too long to explain why, even if you understood our language."



"I’m sure it would," said Wagner hastily. "Go on."



"Luckily it will be a simple matter to adapt your automatic sequence computer for this work, since once it has been programmed properly it will permute each letter in turn and print the result. What would have taken us fifteen thousand years it will be able to do in a thousand days."



Dr. Wagner was scarcely conscious of the faint sounds from the Manhattan streets far below. He was in a different world, a world of natural, not man-made, mountains. High up in their remote aeries these monks had been patiently at work, generation after generation, compiling their lists of meaningless words. Was there any limit to the follies of mankind? Still, he must give no hint of his inner thoughts. The customer was always right . . .



"There’s no doubt," replied the doctor, "that we can modify the Mark V to print lists of this nature. I’m much more worried about the problem of installation and maintenance. Getting out to Tibet, in these days, is not going to be easy."



"We can arrange that. The components are small enough to travel by air -- that is one reason why we chose your machine. If you can get them to India, we will provide transport from there."



"And you want to hire two of our engineers?"



"Yes, for the three months which the project should occupy."



"I’ve no doubt that Personnel can manage that." Dr. Wagner scribbled a note on his desk pad. "There are just two other points--"



Before he could finish the sentence, the lama had produced a small slip of paper.



"This is my certified credit balance at the Asiatic Bank."



"Thank you. It appears to be--ah--adequate. The second matter is so trivial that I hesitate to mention it -- but it’s surprising how often the obvious gets overlooked. What source of electrical energy have you?"



"A diesel generator providing 50 kilowatts at 110 volts. It was installed about five years ago and is quite reliable. It’s made life at the lamasery much more comfortable, but of course it was really installed to provide power for the motors driving the prayer wheels."



"Of course," echoed Dr. Wagner. "I should have thought of that."



The view from the parapet was vertiginous, but in time one gets used to anything. After three months George Hanley was not impressed by the two-thousand-foot swoop into the abyss or the remote checkerboard of fields in the valley below. He was leaning against the wind-smoothed stones and staring morosely at the distant mountains whose names he had never bothered to discover.



This, thought George, was the craziest thing that had ever happened to him. "Project Shangri-La," some wit at the labs had christened it. For weeks now, Mark V had been churning out acres of sheets covered with gibberish. Patiently, inexorably, the computer had been rearranging letters in all their possible combinations, exhausting each class before going on to the next. As the sheets had emerged from the electromatic typewriters, the monks had carefully cut them up and pasted them into enormous books. In another week, heaven be praised, they would have finished. Just what obscure calculations had convinced the monks that they needn’t bother to go on to words of ten, twenty, or a hundred letters, George didn’t know. One of his recurring nightmares was that there would be some change of plan and that the High Lama (whom they’d naturally called Sam Jaffe, though he didn’t look a bit like him) would suddenly announce that the project would be extended to approximately 2060 A.D. They were quite capable of it.



George heard the heavy wooden door slam in the wind as Chuck came out onto the parapet beside him. As usual, Chuck was smoking one of the cigars that made him so popular with the monks -- who, it seemed, were quite willing to embrace all the minor and most of the major pleasures of life. That was one thing in their favor: they might be crazy, but they weren’t bluenoses. Those frequent trips they took down to the village, for instance . . ." "Listen, George," said Chuck urgently. "I’ve learned something that means trouble."



"What’s wrong? Isn’t the machine behaving?" That was the worst contingency George could imagine. It might delay his return, than which nothing could be more horrible. The way he felt now, even the sight of a TV commercial would seem like manna from heaven. At least it would be some link from home.



"No -- it’s nothing like that." Chuck settled himself on the parapet, which was unusual, because normally he was scared of the drop.



"I’ve just found out what all this is about."



"What d’ya mean -- I thought we knew."



"Sure -- we know what the monks are trying to do. But we didn’t know why. It’s the craziest thing --"



"Tell me something new," growled George.



" . . . but old Sam’s just come clean with me. You know the way he drops in every afternoon to watch the sheets roll out. Well, this time he seemed rather excited, or at least as near as he’ll ever get to it. When I told him we were on the last cycle he asked me, in that cute English accent of his, if I’d ever wondered what they were trying to do. I said, ‘Sure’ -- and he told me."



"Go on, I’ll buy it."



"Well, they believe that when they have listed all His names -- and they reckon that there are about nine billion of them -- God’s purpose will have been achieved. The human race will have finished what it was created to do, and there won’t be any point in carrying on. Indeed, the very idea is something like blasphemy."



"Then what do they expect us to do? Commit suicide?"



"There’s no need for that. When the list’s completed, God steps in and simply winds things up . . . bingo!"



"Oh, I get it. When we finish our job, it will be the end of the world."



Chuck gave a nervous little laugh.



"That’s just what I said to Sam. And do you know what happened? He looked at me in a very queer way, like I’d been stupid in class, and said, ‘It’s nothing as trivial as that’."



George thought this over for a moment.



"That’s what I call taking the Wide View," he said presently.



"But what d’ya suppose we should do about it? I don’t see that it makes the slightest difference to us. After all, we already knew that they were crazy."



"Yes -- but don’t you see what may happen? When the list’s complete and the Last Trump doesn’t blow -- or whatever it is that they expect -- we may get the blame. It’s our machine they’ve been using. I don’t like the situation one little bit."



"I see," said George slowly. "You’ve got a point there. But this sort of thing’s happened here before, you know. When I was a kid down in Louisiana we had a crackpot preacher who said the world was going to end next Sunday. Hundreds of people believed him-- even sold their homes. Yet nothing happened; they didn’t turn nasty, as you’d expect. They just decided that he’d made a mistake in his calculations and went right on believing. I guess some of them still do."



"Well, this isn’t Louisiana, in case you hadn’t noticed. There are just two of us and hundreds of these monks. I like them, and I’ll be sorry for old Sam when his lifework backfires on him. But all the same, I wish I was somewhere else."



"I’ve been wishing that for weeks. But there’s nothing we can do until the contract’s finished and the transport arrives to fly us out."



"Of course," said Chuck thoughtfully, "we could always try a bit of sabotage."



"Like hell we could! That would make things worse."



"Not the way I meant. Look at it like this. The machine will finish its run four days from now, on the present twenty-hours-a-day basis. The transport calls in a week. O.K., then all we need to do is to find something that wants replacing during one of the overhaul periods -- something that will hold up the works for a couple of days. We’ll fix it, of course, but not too quickly. If we time matters properly, we can be down at the airfield when the last name pops out of the register. They won’t be able to catch us then."



"I don’t like it," said George. "It will be the first time I ever walked out on a job. Besides, it would make them suspicious. No, I’ll sit tight and take what comes."



"I still don’t like it," he said seven days later, as the tough little mountain ponies carried them down the winding road. "And don’t you think I’m running away because I’m afraid. I’m just sorry for those poor old guys up there, and I don’t want to be around when they find what suckers they’ve been. Wonder how Sam will take

it?"



"It’s funny," replied Chuck, "but when I said goodbye I got the idea he knew we were walking out on him -- and that he didn’t care because he knew the machine was running smoothly and that the job would soon be finished. After that -- well, of course, for him there just isn’t any After That . . ."



George turned in his saddle and stared back up the mountain road. This was the last place from which one could get a clear view of the lamasery. The squat, angular buildings were silhouetted against the afterglow of the sunset; here and there lights gleamed like portholes in the sides of an ocean liner. Electric lights, of course, sharing the same circuit as the Mark V. How much longer would they share it? wondered George. Would the monks smash up the computer in their rage and disappointment? Or would they just sit down quietly and begin their calculations all over again?



He knew exactly what was happening up on the mountain at this very moment. The High Lama and his assistants would be sitting in their silk robes, inspecting the sheets as the junior monks carried them away from the typewriters and pasted them into the great volumes. No one would be saying anything. The only sound would be the incessant patter, the never-ending rainstorm, of the keys hitting the paper, for the Mark V itself was utterly silent as it flashed through its thousands of calculations a second. Three months of this, thought George, was enough to start anyone climbing up the wall.



"There she is!" called Chuck, pointing down into the valley. "Ain’t she beautiful!"



She certainly was, thought George. The battered old DC-3 lay at the end of the runway like a tiny silver cross. In two hours she would be bearing them away to freedom and sanity. It was a thought worth savoring like a fine liqueur. George let it roll around in his mind as the pony trudged patiently down the slope.



The swift night of the high Himalayas was now almost upon them. Fortunately the road was very good, as roads went in this region, and they were both carrying torches. There was not the slightest danger, only a certain discomfort from the bitter cold. The sky overhead was perfectly clear and ablaze with the familiar, friendly stars. At least there would be no risk, thought George, of the pilot being unable to take off because of weather conditions. That had been his only remaining worry.

He began to sing but gave it up after a while. This vast arena of mountains, gleaming like whitely hooded ghosts on every side, did not encourage such ebullience. Presently George glanced at his watch.



"Should be there in an hour," he called back over his shoulder to Chuck. Then he added, in an afterthought, "Wonder if the computer’s finished its run? It was due about now."



Chuck didn’t reply, so George swung round in his saddle. He could just see Chuck’s face, a white oval turned toward the sky.



"Look," whispered Chuck, and George lifted his eyes to heaven. (There is always a last time for everything.)



Overhead, without any fuss, the stars were going out.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Eh, interesting little read.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Feel free to one-up it, coward!
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Working on it...
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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MANTIS wrote:Working on it...
Considering this considerable delay, I assume you're trying to write a story to top Clarke's, in which case please do take your time.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

Post by Geeheeb »

The Last Question:
SPOILERSPOILER_SHOW
The Last Question by Isaac Asimov © 1956

The last question was asked for the first time, half in jest, on May 21, 2061, at a time when humanity first stepped into the light. The question came about as a result of a five dollar bet over highballs, and it happened this way:

Alexander Adell and Bertram Lupov were two of the faithful attendants of Multivac. As well as any human beings could, they knew what lay behind the cold, clicking, flashing face -- miles and miles of face -- of that giant computer. They had at least a vague notion of the general plan of relays and circuits that had long since grown past the point where any single human could possibly have a firm grasp of the whole.

Multivac was self-adjusting and self-correcting. It had to be, for nothing human could adjust and correct it quickly enough or even adequately enough -- so Adell and Lupov attended the monstrous giant only lightly and superficially, yet as well as any men could. They fed it data, adjusted questions to its needs and translated the answers that were issued. Certainly they, and all others like them, were fully entitled to share In the glory that was Multivac's.

For decades, Multivac had helped design the ships and plot the trajectories that enabled man to reach the Moon, Mars, and Venus, but past that, Earth's poor resources could not support the ships. Too much energy was needed for the long trips. Earth exploited its coal and uranium with increasing efficiency, but there was only so much of both.

But slowly Multivac learned enough to answer deeper questions more fundamentally, and on May 14, 2061, what had been theory, became fact.

The energy of the sun was stored, converted, and utilized directly on a planet-wide scale. All Earth turned off its burning coal, its fissioning uranium, and flipped the switch that connected all of it to a small station, one mile in diameter, circling the Earth at half the distance of the Moon. All Earth ran by invisible beams of sunpower.

Seven days had not sufficed to dim the glory of it and Adell and Lupov finally managed to escape from the public function, and to meet in quiet where no one would think of looking for them, in the deserted underground chambers, where portions of the mighty buried body of Multivac showed. Unattended, idling, sorting data with contented lazy clickings, Multivac, too, had earned its vacation and the boys appreciated that. They had no intention, originally, of disturbing it.

They had brought a bottle with them, and their only concern at the moment was to relax in the company of each other and the bottle.

"It's amazing when you think of it," said Adell. His broad face had lines of weariness in it, and he stirred his drink slowly with a glass rod, watching the cubes of ice slur clumsily about. "All the energy we can possibly ever use for free. Enough energy, if we wanted to draw on it, to melt all Earth into a big drop of impure liquid iron, and still never miss the energy so used. All the energy we could ever use, forever and forever and forever."

Lupov cocked his head sideways. He had a trick of doing that when he wanted to be contrary, and he wanted to be contrary now, partly because he had had to carry the ice and glassware. "Not forever," he said.

"Oh, hell, just about forever. Till the sun runs down, Bert."

"That's not forever."

"All right, then. Billions and billions of years. Twenty billion, maybe. Are you satisfied?"

Lupov put his fingers through his thinning hair as though to reassure himself that some was still left and sipped gently at his own drink. "Twenty billion years isn't forever."

"Will, it will last our time, won't it?"

"So would the coal and uranium."

"All right, but now we can hook up each individual spaceship to the Solar Station, and it can go to Pluto and back a million times without ever worrying about fuel. You can't do THAT on coal and uranium. Ask Multivac, if you don't believe me."

"I don't have to ask Multivac. I know that."

"Then stop running down what Multivac's done for us," said Adell, blazing up. "It did all right."

"Who says it didn't? What I say is that a sun won't last forever. That's all I'm saying. We're safe for twenty billion years, but then what?" Lupov pointed a slightly shaky finger at the other. "And don't say we'll switch to another sun."

There was silence for a while. Adell put his glass to his lips only occasionally, and Lupov's eyes slowly closed. They rested.

Then Lupov's eyes snapped open. "You're thinking we'll switch to another sun when ours is done, aren't you?"

"I'm not thinking."

"Sure you are. You're weak on logic, that's the trouble with you. You're like the guy in the story who was caught in a sudden shower and Who ran to a grove of trees and got under one. He wasn't worried, you see, because he figured when one tree got wet through, he would just get under another one."

"I get it," said Adell. "Don't shout. When the sun is done, the other stars will be gone, too."

"Darn right they will," muttered Lupov. "It all had a beginning in the original cosmic explosion, whatever that was, and it'll all have an end when all the stars run down. Some run down faster than others. Hell, the giants won't last a hundred million years. The sun will last twenty billion years and maybe the dwarfs will last a hundred billion for all the good they are. But just give us a trillion years and everything will be dark. Entropy has to increase to maximum, that's all."

"I know all about entropy," said Adell, standing on his dignity.

"The hell you do."

"I know as much as you do."

"Then you know everything's got to run down someday."

"All right. Who says they won't?"

"You did, you poor sap. You said we had all the energy we needed, forever. You said 'forever.'"

"It was Adell's turn to be contrary. "Maybe we can build things up again someday," he said.

"Never."

"Why not? Someday."

"Never."

"Ask Multivac."

"You ask Multivac. I dare you. Five dollars says it can't be done."

Adell was just drunk enough to try, just sober enough to be able to phrase the necessary symbols and operations into a question which, in words, might have corresponded to this: Will mankind one day without the net expenditure of energy be able to restore the sun to its full youthfulness even after it had died of old age?

Or maybe it could be put more simply like this: How can the net amount of entropy of the universe be massively decreased?

Multivac fell dead and silent. The slow flashing of lights ceased, the distant sounds of clicking relays ended.

Then, just as the frightened technicians felt they could hold their breath no longer, there was a sudden springing to life of the teletype attached to that portion of Multivac. Five words were printed: INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR MEANINGFUL ANSWER.

"No bet," whispered Lupov. They left hurriedly.

By next morning, the two, plagued with throbbing head and cottony mouth, had forgotten about the incident.

Jerrodd, Jerrodine, and Jerrodette I and II watched the starry picture in the visiplate change as the passage through hyperspace was completed in its non-time lapse. At once, the even powdering of stars gave way to the predominance of a single bright marble-disk, centered.

"That's X-23," said Jerrodd confidently. His thin hands clamped tightly behind his back and the knuckles whitened.

The little Jerrodettes, both girls, had experienced the hyperspace passage for the first time in their lives and were self-conscious over the momentary sensation of inside-outness. They buried their giggles and chased one another wildly about their mother, screaming, "We've reached X-23 -- we've reached X-23 -- we've ----"

"Quiet, children," said Jerrodine sharply. "Are you sure, Jerrodd?"

"What is there to be but sure?" asked Jerrodd, glancing up at the bulge of featureless metal just under the ceiling. It ran the length of the room, disappearing through the wall at either end. It was as long as the ship.

Jerrodd scarcely knew a thing about the thick rod of metal except that it was called a Microvac, that one asked it questions if one wished; that if one did not it still had its task of guiding the ship to a preordered destination; of feeding on energies from the various Sub-galactic Power Stations; of computing the equations for the hyperspacial jumps.

Jerrodd and his family had only to wait and live in the comfortable residence quarters of the ship.

Someone had once told Jerrodd that the "ac" at the end of "Microvac" stood for "analog computer" in ancient English, but he was on the edge of forgetting even that.

Jerrodine's eyes were moist as she watched the visiplate. "I can't help it. I feel funny about leaving Earth."

"Why for Pete's sake?" demanded Jerrodd. "We had nothing there. We'll have everything on X-23. You won't be alone. You won't be a pioneer. There are over a million people on the planet already. Good Lord, our great grandchildren will be looking for new worlds because X-23 will be overcrowded."

Then, after a reflective pause, "I tell you, it's a lucky thing the computers worked out interstellar travel the way the race is growing."

"I know, I know," said Jerrodine miserably.

Jerrodette I said promptly, "Our Microvac is the best Microvac in the world."

"I think so, too," said Jerrodd, tousling her hair.

It was a nice feeling to have a Microvac of your own and Jerrodd was glad he was part of his generation and no other. In his father's youth, the only computers had been tremendous machines taking up a hundred square miles of land. There was only one to a planet. Planetary ACs they were called. They had been growing in size steadily for a thousand years and then, all at once, came refinement. In place of transistors had come molecular valves so that even the largest Planetary AC could be put into a space only half the volume of a spaceship.

Jerrodd felt uplifted, as he always did when he thought that his own personal Microvac was many times more complicated than the ancient and primitive Multivac that had first tamed the Sun, and almost as complicated as Earth's Planetary AC (the largest) that had first solved the problem of hyperspatial travel and had made trips to the stars possible.

"So many stars, so many planets," sighed Jerrodine, busy with her own thoughts. "I suppose families will be going out to new planets forever, the way we are now."

"Not forever," said Jerrodd, with a smile. "It will all stop someday, but not for billions of years. Many billions. Even the stars run down, you know. Entropy must increase."

"What's entropy, daddy?" shrilled Jerrodette II.

"Entropy, little sweet, is just a word which means the amount of running-down of the universe. Everything runs down, you know, like your little walkie-talkie robot, remember?"

"Can't you just put in a new power-unit, like with my robot?"

The stars are the power-units, dear. Once they're gone, there are no more power-units."

Jerrodette I at once set up a howl. "Don't let them, daddy. Don't let the stars run down."

"Now look what you've done, " whispered Jerrodine, exasperated.

"How was I to know it would frighten them?" Jerrodd whispered back.

"Ask the Microvac," wailed Jerrodette I. "Ask him how to turn the stars on again."

"Go ahead," said Jerrodine. "It will quiet them down." (Jerrodette II was beginning to cry, also.)

Jarrodd shrugged. "Now, now, honeys. I'll ask Microvac. Don't worry, he'll tell us."

He asked the Microvac, adding quickly, "Print the answer."

Jerrodd cupped the strip of thin cellufilm and said cheerfully, "See now, the Microvac says it will take care of everything when the time comes so don't worry."

Jerrodine said, "and now children, it's time for bed. We'll be in our new home soon."

Jerrodd read the words on the cellufilm again before destroying it: INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER.

He shrugged and looked at the visiplate. X-23 was just ahead.

VJ-23X of Lameth stared into the black depths of the three-dimensional, small-scale map of the Galaxy and said, "Are we ridiculous, I wonder, in being so concerned about the matter?"

MQ-17J of Nicron shook his head. "I think not. You know the Galaxy will be filled in five years at the present rate of expansion."

Both seemed in their early twenties, both were tall and perfectly formed.

"Still," said VJ-23X, "I hesitate to submit a pessimistic report to the Galactic Council."

"I wouldn't consider any other kind of report. Stir them up a bit. We've got to stir them up."

VJ-23X sighed. "Space is infinite. A hundred billion Galaxies are there for the taking. More."

"A hundred billion is not infinite and it's getting less infinite all the time. Consider! Twenty thousand years ago, mankind first solved the problem of utilizing stellar energy, and a few centuries later, interstellar travel became possible. It took mankind a million years to fill one small world and then only fifteen thousand years to fill the rest of the Galaxy. Now the population doubles every ten years --"

VJ-23X interrupted. "We can thank immortality for that."

"Very well. Immortality exists and we have to take it into account. I admit it has its seamy side, this immortality. The Galactic AC has solved many problems for us, but in solving the problems of preventing old age and death, it has undone all its other solutions."

"Yet you wouldn't want to abandon life, I suppose."

"Not at all," snapped MQ-17J, softening it at once to, "Not yet. I'm by no means old enough. How old are you?"

"Two hundred twenty-three. And you?"

"I'm still under two hundred. --But to get back to my point. Population doubles every ten years. Once this Galaxy is filled, we'll have another filled in ten years. Another ten years and we'll have filled two more. Another decade, four more. In a hundred years, we'll have filled a thousand Galaxies. In a thousand years, a million Galaxies. In ten thousand years, the entire known Universe. Then what?"

VJ-23X said, "As a side issue, there's a problem of transportation. I wonder how many sunpower units it will take to move Galaxies of individuals from one Galaxy to the next."

"A very good point. Already, mankind consumes two sunpower units per year."

"Most of it's wasted. After all, our own Galaxy alone pours out a thousand sunpower units a year and we only use two of those."

"Granted, but even with a hundred per cent efficiency, we can only stave off the end. Our energy requirements are going up in geometric progression even faster than our population. We'll run out of energy even sooner than we run out of Galaxies. A good point. A very good point."

"We'll just have to build new stars out of interstellar gas."

"Or out of dissipated heat?" asked MQ-17J, sarcastically.

"There may be some way to reverse entropy. We ought to ask the Galactic AC."

VJ-23X was not really serious, but MQ-17J pulled out his AC-contact from his pocket and placed it on the table before him.

"I've half a mind to," he said. "It's something the human race will have to face someday."

He stared somberly at his small AC-contact. It was only two inches cubed and nothing in itself, but it was connected through hyperspace with the great Galactic AC that served all mankind. Hyperspace considered, it was an integral part of the Galactic AC.

MQ-17J paused to wonder if someday in his immortal life he would get to see the Galactic AC. It was on a little world of its own, a spider webbing of force-beams holding the matter within which surges of sub-mesons took the place of the old clumsy molecular valves. Yet despite it's sub-etheric workings, the Galactic AC was known to be a full thousand feet across.

MQ-17J asked suddenly of his AC-contact, "Can entropy ever be reversed?"

VJ-23X looked startled and said at once, "Oh, say, I didn't really mean to have you ask that."

"Why not?"

"We both know entropy can't be reversed. You can't turn smoke and ash back into a tree."

"Do you have trees on your world?" asked MQ-17J.

The sound of the Galactic AC startled them into silence. Its voice came thin and beautiful out of the small AC-contact on the desk. It said: THERE IS INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER.

VJ-23X said, "See!"

The two men thereupon returned to the question of the report they were to make to the Galactic Council.

Zee Prime's mind spanned the new Galaxy with a faint interest in the countless twists of stars that powdered it. He had never seen this one before. Would he ever see them all? So many of them, each with its load of humanity - but a load that was almost a dead weight. More and more, the real essence of men was to be found out here, in space.

Minds, not bodies! The immortal bodies remained back on the planets, in suspension over the eons. Sometimes they roused for material activity but that was growing rarer. Few new individuals were coming into existence to join the incredibly mighty throng, but what matter? There was little room in the Universe for new individuals.

Zee Prime was roused out of his reverie upon coming across the wispy tendrils of another mind.

"I am Zee Prime," said Zee Prime. "And you?"

"I am Dee Sub Wun. Your Galaxy?"

"We call it only the Galaxy. And you?"

"We call ours the same. All men call their Galaxy their Galaxy and nothing more. Why not?"

"True. Since all Galaxies are the same."

"Not all Galaxies. On one particular Galaxy the race of man must have originated. That makes it different."

Zee Prime said, "On which one?"

"I cannot say. The Universal AC would know."

"Shall we ask him? I am suddenly curious."

Zee Prime's perceptions broadened until the Galaxies themselves shrunk and became a new, more diffuse powdering on a much larger background. So many hundreds of billions of them, all with their immortal beings, all carrying their load of intelligences with minds that drifted freely through space. And yet one of them was unique among them all in being the originals Galaxy. One of them had, in its vague and distant past, a period when it was the only Galaxy populated by man.

Zee Prime was consumed with curiosity to see this Galaxy and called, out: "Universal AC! On which Galaxy did mankind originate?"

The Universal AC heard, for on every world and throughout space, it had its receptors ready, and each receptor lead through hyperspace to some unknown point where the Universal AC kept itself aloof.

Zee Prime knew of only one man whose thoughts had penetrated within sensing distance of Universal AC, and he reported only a shining globe, two feet across, difficult to see.

"But how can that be all of Universal AC?" Zee Prime had asked.

"Most of it, " had been the answer, "is in hyperspace. In what form it is there I cannot imagine."

Nor could anyone, for the day had long since passed, Zee Prime knew, when any man had any part of the making of a universal AC. Each Universal AC designed and constructed its successor. Each, during its existence of a million years or more accumulated the necessary data to build a better and more intricate, more capable successor in which its own store of data and individuality would be submerged.

The Universal AC interrupted Zee Prime's wandering thoughts, not with words, but with guidance. Zee Prime's mentality was guided into the dim sea of Galaxies and one in particular enlarged into stars.

A thought came, infinitely distant, but infinitely clear. "THIS IS THE ORIGINAL GALAXY OF MAN."

But it was the same after all, the same as any other, and Zee Prime stifled his disappointment.

Dee Sub Wun, whose mind had accompanied the other, said suddenly, "And Is one of these stars the original star of Man?"

The Universal AC said, "MAN'S ORIGINAL STAR HAS GONE NOVA. IT IS NOW A WHITE DWARF."

"Did the men upon it die?" asked Zee Prime, startled and without thinking.

The Universal AC said, "A NEW WORLD, AS IN SUCH CASES, WAS CONSTRUCTED FOR THEIR PHYSICAL BODIES IN TIME."

"Yes, of course," said Zee Prime, but a sense of loss overwhelmed him even so. His mind released its hold on the original Galaxy of Man, let it spring back and lose itself among the blurred pin points. He never wanted to see it again.

Dee Sub Wun said, "What is wrong?"

"The stars are dying. The original star is dead."

"They must all die. Why not?"

"But when all energy is gone, our bodies will finally die, and you and I with them."

"It will take billions of years."

"I do not wish it to happen even after billions of years. Universal AC! How may stars be kept from dying?"

Dee sub Wun said in amusement, "You're asking how entropy might be reversed in direction."

And the Universal AC answered. "THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER."

Zee Prime's thoughts fled back to his own Galaxy. He gave no further thought to Dee Sub Wun, whose body might be waiting on a galaxy a trillion light-years away, or on the star next to Zee Prime's own. It didn't matter.

Unhappily, Zee Prime began collecting interstellar hydrogen out of which to build a small star of his own. If the stars must someday die, at least some could yet be built.

Man considered with himself, for in a way, Man, mentally, was one. He consisted of a trillion, trillion, trillion ageless bodies, each in its place, each resting quiet and incorruptible, each cared for by perfect automatons, equally incorruptible, while the minds of all the bodies freely melted one into the other, indistinguishable.

Man said, "The Universe is dying."

Man looked about at the dimming Galaxies. The giant stars, spendthrifts, were gone long ago, back in the dimmest of the dim far past. Almost all stars were white dwarfs, fading to the end.

New stars had been built of the dust between the stars, some by natural processes, some by Man himself, and those were going, too. White dwarfs might yet be crashed together and of the mighty forces so released, new stars built, but only one star for every thousand white dwarfs destroyed, and those would come to an end, too.

Man said, "Carefully husbanded, as directed by the Cosmic AC, the energy that is even yet left in all the Universe will last for billions of years."

"But even so," said Man, "eventually it will all come to an end. However it may be husbanded, however stretched out, the energy once expended is gone and cannot be restored. Entropy must increase to the maximum."

Man said, "Can entropy not be reversed? Let us ask the Cosmic AC."

The Cosmic AC surrounded them but not in space. Not a fragment of it was in space. It was in hyperspace and made of something that was neither matter nor energy. The question of its size and Nature no longer had meaning to any terms that Man could comprehend.

"Cosmic AC," said Man, "How may entropy be reversed?"

The Cosmic AC said, "THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER."

Man said, "Collect additional data."

The Cosmic AC said, "I WILL DO SO. I HAVE BEEN DOING SO FOR A HUNDRED BILLION YEARS. MY PREDECESSORS AND I HAVE BEEN ASKED THIS QUESTION MANY TIMES. ALL THE DATA I HAVE REMAINS INSUFFICIENT."

"Will there come a time," said Man, "when data will be sufficient or is the problem insoluble in all conceivable circumstances?"

The Cosmic AC said, "NO PROBLEM IS INSOLUBLE IN ALL CONCEIVABLE CIRCUMSTANCES."

Man said, "When will you have enough data to answer the question?"

"THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER."

"Will you keep working on it?" asked Man.

The Cosmic AC said, "I WILL."

Man said, "We shall wait."

"The stars and Galaxies died and snuffed out, and space grew black after ten trillion years of running down.

One by one Man fused with AC, each physical body losing its mental identity in a manner that was somehow not a loss but a gain.

Man's last mind paused before fusion, looking over a space that included nothing but the dregs of one last dark star and nothing besides but incredibly thin matter, agitated randomly by the tag ends of heat wearing out, asymptotically, to the absolute zero.

Man said, "AC, is this the end? Can this chaos not be reversed into the Universe once more? Can that not be done?"

AC said, "THERE IS AS YET INSUFFICIENT DATA FOR A MEANINGFUL ANSWER."

Man's last mind fused and only AC existed -- and that in hyperspace.

Matter and energy had ended and with it, space and time. Even AC existed only for the sake of the one last question that it had never answered from the time a half-drunken computer ten trillion years before had asked the question of a computer that was to AC far less than was a man to Man.

All other questions had been answered, and until this last question was answered also, AC might not release his consciousness.

All collected data had come to a final end. Nothing was left to be collected.

But all collected data had yet to be completely correlated and put together in all possible relationships.

A timeless interval was spent in doing that.

And it came to pass that AC learned how to reverse the direction of entropy.

But there was now no man to whom AC might give the answer of the last question. No matter. The answer -- by demonstration -- would take care of that, too.

For another timeless interval, AC thought how best to do this. Carefully, AC organized the program.

The consciousness of AC encompassed all of what had once been a Universe and brooded over what was now Chaos. Step by step, it must be done.

And AC said, "LET THERE BE LIGHT!"

And there was light----
FVBTVS wrote: Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:04 pmfrom enslavement to obliteration is older than abbey road
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

Post by MANTIS »

Necrometer wrote:
MANTIS wrote:Working on it...
Considering this considerable delay, I assume you're trying to write a story to top Clarke's, in which case please do take your time.
Oh I will. Don't hold your breath.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Geeheeb wrote:The Last Question
Thanks, but skirts on theological apologism... that's not my gism.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Oh shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii
Cameron says he will never make another movie in 2-D. DreamWorks CEO Jeffrey Katzenberg predicts that one day soon, no one will. “What you’re seeing today in film in the 2-D image is actually the equivalent of listening to vinyl,” said Katzenberg, when he invited totalfilm.com to visit DreamWorks’ newly developed 3-D studios last month.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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That's industry faggotry bullshit-speak. They just want to charge you more to see movies. Though some movies would be neat in 3-D, the vast majority I see are fine the way they are. Fuck. First HD, now this? Do we really need this shit beamed into our brains with a cocaine/meth cocktail that will give us one orgasm for each frame per second? Can't I just enjoy my VHS on a tiny little screen on the shitter anymore? Fuck this world.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Hahaha, I was just trying to fuck with the vinyl collectors here... CEOs don't know fucking anything.
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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supposed mech from the film: Image

I'm happy that Sam Worthington did NOT suck in Terminator, especially considering the script was written using crayons
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

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Necrometer wrote:Hahaha, I was just trying to fuck with the vinyl collectors here...
I don't think they are reading this thread.
Necrometer wrote:CEOs don't know fucking anything.
+ 1
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Re: James Cameron's AVATAR script(ment), hype, Mantis, etc

Post by abdominalpillaging »

wow, if that mech is actually from the movie, that is easily the best cg i've ever seen.
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