Black holes might be intelligent

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Necrometer
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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I think it's futile because the word's "hypothesis" meaning is so widespread in common speech and being a stickler for the "law" definition does... nothing? I think it's alienating and gums up conversation. I guess I'd put scientific accessibility above science literacy? And even if somehow everyone on Earth stops using the "hypothesis" definition, it's not going to finally defeat the braindead "EVOLUTION IS JUST A THEORY" creationist fucks. They'll just say something else nauseatingly stupid.

And I didn't think you were trying to talk down to Goatus. It seemed like you were trying to trump him by framing him for using a word with an alternate meaning that you know damn well he didn't intend.
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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hahaha i fucking despise that 'theory' and 'hypothesis' and 'law' hair splitting faggotry too
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Necrometer wrote: It seemed like you were trying to trump him by framing him for using a word with an alternate meaning that you know damn well he didn't intend.
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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touche :cheers:
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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:invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross:
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Looks like some physicists just got Dr. Who Season 5 on Blu-ray.
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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fallbacktostone wrote:

:invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross: :invcross:
ॐ त्रियम्बकं यजामहे, सुगन्धिं पुष्टिवर्धनं

उर्वारुकमिव बन्धनान् मृत्योर्मोक्षिय मामृतात्
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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https://uwaterloo.ca/news/news/quantum- ... s-distance

Quantum teleportation goes distance

WATERLOO, Ont. (Wednesday, Sept. 5, 2012) - An international research team including several scientists from the University of Waterloo has achieved quantum teleportation over a record-breaking distance of 143 kilometres through free space.
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The experiment saw the successful teleportation of quantum information — in this case, the states of light particles, or photons — between the Canary Islands of La Palma and Tenerife. The breakthrough is a crucial step toward quantum communications via satellite.

Unlike the teleportation of solid objects popularized in science fiction, the experiment involved the teleportation of quantum states, an essential pre-requisite of quantum computing, quantum communication and other powerful technologies under development at the Institute for Quantum Computing (IQC) at Waterloo.

The project, led by researchers from Vienna’s Institute for Quantum Optics and Quantum Information, relied on algorithms and equipment developed in Waterloo. Their results were published this week in Nature http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/va ... 11472.html.

Teleportation across 143 kilometres is a crucial milestone in this research, since that is roughly the minimum distance between the ground and orbiting satellites. This achievement leads to the possibility of quantum teleportation between ground stations and orbiting satellites, a key goal in the research of Professor Thomas Jennewein, an IQC faculty member and collaborator on the record-setting experiment.

For this experiment, Jennewein developed the coincidence algorithm, which synchronized and measured the transfer of photons between the two sites in the Canary Islands.

The ultra-precise clocks needed to measure the teleportation of photon states were aligned to each other to within a nanosecond, or one-billionth of a second. Such precision will be necessary in the development of satellite-based quantum communications networks.

“The experiment paves the way toward teleportation of signals over free space, or even using satellites,” said Jennewein, whose research is largely focused on the creation of large-scale quantum communications networks. “This is useful for applications in secure communication, as well as the possibility of networking full-scale quantum computers, once they exist.”

IQC research assistant professor Vadim Makarov, along with PhD student Elena Anisimova, designed the highly sensitive photon detectors, which allowed the teleportation to occur with high precision despite some hazy air conditions.

Makarov and Anisimova were recruited to help overcome inclement atmospheric conditions caused by dust whipped up from the Sahara Desert in the summer of 2011 that foiled the first attempt at the teleportation experiment. Makarov’s photon detectors, and more cooperative weather, allowed for a successful experiment last April.

Because there is less atmospheric disturbance when communicating upwards to space than between the Canary Islands, Makarov says the next logical step is to attempt teleportation between the earth and a satellite.

Makarov was in the Canary Islands for the experiment, but Jennewein stayed in Waterloo, connecting with his international colleagues via Skype to lend troubleshooting tips and scientific expertise.
Will await developments...
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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:what:
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

Post by Blair »

ANSIBLES!!!!

:invcross: :invcross: :invcross:

EDIT: Use an Ansible to operate a remote body to fuck some three-titted space whore in outer rim while your body is still on earth!

Space Internet!
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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i just tried explaining what this means to my friends aftrer i had a little jameson and ive never sounded stupider :invcross:
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

Post by Blair »

I have had many drunken conversations about this topic.

:drooly:
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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...not to be confused with "ansellable" e.g. "my girlfriend's face is totally ansellable"

last night on Family Feud lightning round one was "name something that exists in outer space" and the lady went with "aliens"... survey says: 8/100... which is sort of a relief but not really
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Common Interpretation of Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle Is Proved False
A new experiment shows that measuring a quantum system does not necessarily introduce uncertainty

By Geoff Brumfiel

http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... R_20120919
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Contrary to what many students are taught, quantum uncertainty may not always be in the eye of the beholder. A new experiment shows that measuring a quantum system does not necessarily introduce uncertainty. The study overthrows a common classroom explanation of why the quantum world appears so fuzzy, but the fundamental limit to what is knowable at the smallest scales remains unchanged.

At the foundation of quantum mechanics is the Heisenberg uncertainty principle. Simply put, the principle states that there is a fundamental limit to what one can know about a quantum system. For example, the more precisely one knows a particle's position, the less one can know about its momentum, and vice versa. The limit is expressed as a simple equation that is straightforward to prove mathematically.

Heisenberg sometimes explained the uncertainty principle as a problem of making measurements. His most well-known thought experiment involved photographing an electron. To take the picture, a scientist might bounce a light particle off the electron's surface. That would reveal its position, but it would also impart energy to the electron, causing it to move. Learning about the electron's position would create uncertainty in its velocity; and the act of measurement would produce the uncertainty needed to satisfy the principle.

Physics students are still taught this measurement-disturbance version of the uncertainty principle in introductory classes, but it turns out that it's not always true. Aephraim Steinberg of the University of Toronto in Canada and his team have performed measurements on photons (particles of light) and showed that the act of measuring can introduce less uncertainty than is required by Heisenberg’s principle. The total uncertainty of what can be known about the photon's properties, however, remains above Heisenberg's limit.

Delicate measurement
Steinberg's group does not measure position and momentum, but rather two different inter-related properties of a photon: its polarization states. In this case, the polarization along one plane is intrinsically tied to the polarization along the other, and by Heisenberg’s principle, there is a limit to the certainty with which both states can be known.

The researchers made a ‘weak’ measurement of the photon’s polarization in one plane — not enough to disturb it, but enough to produce a rough sense of its orientation. Next, they measured the polarization in the second plane. Then they made an exact, or 'strong', measurement of the first polarization to see whether it had been disturbed by the second measurement.

When the researchers did the experiment multiple times, they found that measurement of one polarization did not always disturb the other state as much as the uncertainty principle predicted. In the strongest case, the induced fuzziness was as little as half of what would be predicted by the uncertainty principle.

Don't get too excited: the uncertainty principle still stands, says Steinberg: “In the end, there's no way you can know [both quantum states] accurately at the same time.” But the experiment shows that the act of measurement isn't always what causes the uncertainty. “If there's already a lot of uncertainty in the system, then there doesn't need to be any noise from the measurement at all,” he says.

The latest experiment is the second to make a measurement below the uncertainty noise limit. Earlier this year, Yuji Hasegawa, a physicist at the Vienna University of Technology in Austria, measured groups of neutron spins and derived results well below what would be predicted if measurements were inserting all the uncertainty into the system.

But the latest results are the clearest example yet of why Heisenberg’s explanation was incorrect. "This is the most direct experimental test of the Heisenberg measurement-disturbance uncertainty principle," says Howard Wiseman, a theoretical physicist at Griffith University in Brisbane, Australia "Hopefully it will be useful for educating textbook writers so they know that the naive measurement-disturbance relation is wrong."

Shaking the old measurement-uncertainty explanation may be difficult, however. Even after doing the experiment, Steinberg still included a question about how measurements create uncertainty on a recent homework assignment for his students. "Only as I was grading it did I realize that my homework assignment was wrong," he says. "Now I have to be more careful."

This article is reproduced with permission from the magazine Nature. The article was first published on September 11, 2012.
This article may have some issues with actually looking at the accuracy of the measurements from these trials vs. the certainty of these measurements, but I should just wait for a time when I'm fully awake to reread this.
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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I never even tried to grasp that principle as a quantitative thing, where there's some % amount of error added to a given system. Rather I thought the point was that you can NEVER know the position & momentum of a given subatomic particle because measuring those things must change them. This qualitative version is still intact, as it will (almost certainly) remain. I don't think it's super revolutionary that these guys are finding that the energy transfer between observer/observee is different in scale compared to whatever the previous people worked out. Such values are refined all the time. I think?

Edit: I am totally stupid and did this thing that this guy said people do:
As Wikipedia says, the uncertainty principle is often confused with the observer effect. Please see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncertainty_principle
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Observer_effect_(physics)
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As I understand (with of course, some degree of uncertainty), the uncertainty principle most precisely pertains to measurements that depend on the particle/wave states of matter. For example, measuring the location of a photon requires that its wave function be collapsed, manifesting the photon as a particle. Measuring its momentum, of course, requires the photon to remain in its self-propagating wave state.

As I understand, measuring "interrelated polarization states" along one plane infers some crucial information about the polarization along the other plane. In neither case is the collapse of the wave function required to complete the necessary measurement...

The article states:
"The researchers made a 'weak' measurement of the photon’s polarization in one plane - not enough to disturb it, but enough to produce a rough sense of its orientation. Next, they measured the polarization in the second plane. Then they made an exact, or 'strong', measurement of the first polarization to see whether it had been disturbed by the second measurement.

"When the researchers did the experiment multiple times, they found that measurement of one polarization did not always disturb the other state as much as the uncertainty principle predicted. In the strongest case, the induced fuzziness was as little as half of what would be predicted by the uncertainty principle."

I don't think this uncertainty principle properly applies to the subtle, interrelated measurements tested in this experimental procedure...
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ahahaha this saddsakk from the comments:
Didn't Heisenberg know what he himself was saying in his formula? Did he know what he was supposedly saying? Then why couldn't he frame an interpretation in keeping with what he claimed was reality? If his "explanation" didn't really represent what he was claiming, how certain can anyone be that what he was claiming represented reality?
This may cause this to be removed, but, again, this is only what "scientists" insist, from behind "laboratory" doors, that the "rank and file" believe. Not one member of the "rank and file" has ever seen anything that is consistent with quantum mechanics, relativity, "evolution". Shills will doff such doggerel as "when you flip the switch, the lights come on, therefore quantum mechanics is true!" Believe it, they do say things like that. But that's what scammers have been doing for a long time. "Planes went into the Twin Towers, therefore Muslims do want to kill every American!"
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Last edited by Necrometer on Thu Sep 20, 2012 8:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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He covered a lot of ground there!
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Where are we in the Church of H.B. lectionary?
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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"When the researchers did the experiment multiple times, they found that measurement of one polarization did not always disturb the other state as much as the uncertainty principle predicted. In the strongest case, the induced fuzziness was as little as half of what would be predicted by the uncertainty principle."

Umm... How do they know how far off their fuzzed measurements are :?:
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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solidaritywithfruit wrote:Umm... How do they know how far off their fuzzed measurements are :?:
I'm totally out of my depth but... yes, this. I think there's some math (based on previous experiments?) that tells them how far measurements should deviate from ideal/expected behavior, and so now these new experiments are forcing them to update the math?
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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http://www.livescience.com/23419-eterna ... ystal.html
The idea for an eternal clock that would continue to keep time even after the universe ceased to exist has intrigued physicists. However, no one has figured out how one might be built, until now.

Researchers have now proposed an experimental design for a "space-time crystal" that would be able to keep time forever.

...

In other words, the scientists would aim to create a ring of charged particles, with the resulting electromagnetic forces causing the structure to rotate perpetually. At its lowest quantum-energy state, also known as its ground state, the system has no disorder, or entropy, and there is no way for its entropy to increase over time. Thus, the crystal's temporal structure and timekeeping ability would continue even after the universe reached a state of "heat death," also known as thermodynamic equilibrium, when it had devolved into entropy.
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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hahaha, that's a good one Luke

today at 5 - should I listen to this hour-long load of horseshit?
"Planetary protection... on Earth and beyond"

Margaret Race is concerned with protecting the planets. Actually, protecting all the planets: but especially Earth and Mars. Her work focuses on the scientific, technical, legal and societal issues of ensuring that missions to the Red Planet and other solar system bodies do not either inadvertently bring terrestrial microbes along, which would complicate our search for indigenous extraterrestrial life, or return any microbes to Earth. Recently, she’s done a research study on the environmental impact reviews and public communication associated with high-containment biosafety labs – the type that will eventually be used for the quarantine of returned samples from Mars.

Her interest in extraterrestrial organisms is linked closely to her long term ecological research on exotic and invasive species. She’s also actively involved in education and public outreach about astrobiology. Since her early work with the Environmental Protection Agency as a Public Information Specialist, and her tenure at San Francisco television station KQED, Margaret has had a strong interest in the communication of science via the mass media. She especially likes to work with journalists and educators as they develop materials about complex, controversial issues in space exploration and environmental protection. Her enthusiasm is infectious, and her work ensures that our spacecraft won’t be.
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Re: Black holes might be intelligent

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Fuck that calvinist hippie bullshit that needs to leave the hall, aside from theoretical situations where there is an indigenous biosphere, we should be deliberately spewing life about space.
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