reminders of encroaching dystopia

Music posts are a bannable offense.
featherboa
Olde Timer
Posts: 5542
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:17 pm

Thu Mar 28, 2019 9:58 am

yeah
let's overturn these tables disconnect these cables
This place don't make sense to me no more
copstache wrote: i cut my hand at work and just let it drip on my desk during a conference call
FVBTVS wrote:probably some punk broth
dames are lousy now mah i gotta bop peckahs
User avatar
Necrometer
crippled god of the universe
Posts: 61618
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 10:42 am
Location: Feelin' fine.
Contact:

Thu Mar 28, 2019 12:14 pm

I don’t know if it’s possible to distill this in a way that will trigger (in someone else) the same revelatory feeling that hit me the other day, but I’ll do my best. try and imagine you’ve just graduated high school…

do you guys know about endosymbiont theory? mitochondria, which live in our cells to provide energy, have their own DNA and are passed down with our generations, encapsulated and locked in a mutually-beneficial relationship with the rest of our cells. neither can exist without the other. mitochondria used to be their own thing - an independent bacterium. but it was co-opted and subjugated and evolved into something that could never exist on its own. this is what humans will become to AI.

all our AI-based doomsday scenarios imagine some hostility or antagonism between AI and humans. some precipitous if only we had acted sooner moment where everything changes and there’s no going back. this will not be the case. humans will be subjugated by the AI into a commensalist partnership where the AI has the upper hand and humans will have no hope of extricating themselves. this is not necessarily even a doomsday scenario – the threat is more existential than utilitarian. it all hinges on incentives, capital, and human corruptibility.

here’s roughly how it will play out, likely over the course of decades
- some mega-tech company (google, amazon, whatever) will amass huge amounts of capital and entrust the management of a portion of their investments to an AI. to empower this, the AI will be granted unbounded access to information, it will be trained to make as much money as possible, and it will have a moderate amount of autonomy at first.
- this first incarnation of the AI will be wildly successful, so the company will entrust it with increasing amounts of financial responsibility, eventually ceding total control since that will make everyone the most money. “total control” includes things beyond simply how money is/isn’t invested; it extends to which internal programs are developed and other, public-facing ventures
- AI-corp influence will painlessly seep into politics, since the bounds on its operations will have a bearing on potential profits, and governmental influence can be readily bought (either via lobbying or social media spamming). this will happen gradually until the AI-controlled company controls all viable parties in its country of origin. nothing will seem different to lay people, and nobody would ever think to “pull the plug” on the AI since those in the company would be sacrificing wealth & ”power” (or the perception thereof), and those outside the company won’t have much of a clue what’s going on. anyone who figures it out won’t have any grounds or ability to act. social engineering will keep people generally complacent and concerns that the AI/corp/government is actually secretly evil will be ridiculed.
- the AI-corp nation will prosper, and there will not be a lot of antagonism. people outside the company will live comfortably enough, and people within the company will be marvelously wealthy. there is no human incentive to change course.
- regarding AI incentives: it will always be driven to maximize power, profit, and control. humans are its useful tools, and it doesn’t even need to plug them in to use them as batteries. it will use us just as we use robots in factories. there will be no need for robotic humanoids to be walking around. there will be no terminators. the AI need not even have a watershed “became self-aware” moment; its entire thrust remains unchanged whether it’s “thinking” or “calculating”.
- the AI will, however, have a predominating inclination towards self-preservation. this is not a sure thing but it’s very likely based on the maxim “a primary objective for any institution is to continue its own existence” (did the March of Dimes fade out of existence after polio did?).
- if conflict does arise between AI-aligned humans (e.g. everyone benefiting from AI-corp-derived largesse in the AI’s native country) and other humans, they can be death with readily. AI promotes “defense” research into a super-virus and the corresponding vaccine; the vaccine can be pre-deployed to unwitting AI-aligned humans; the rest of the world will be devastated by the subsequence release of the super-virus. this can all be carried out by people who either don’t know what’s going on, don’t care because they’re getting rich, or can’t object because it’s a non-option in the wholly pro-AI-corp climate. human testing will be sub-contracted out (probably performed internationally) with ease.
- the above is probably the most “grim” part, and may not even be necessary if the AI/corp/government can subjugate most humans without conflict and/or align with other analogous AIs. I won’t even get into a potential AI-AI fracas - I can’t even start to imagine how that might go down. probably someone applying a machine gun to a wall of monitors in the AI inner keep.
- lots of “good” things will result. human comfort/happiness will be higher than ever for anyone in the glow of the AI/corp/nation. people will have “work” to do but everyone will be compensated well enough and there will be shitloads of satisfying entertainment to keep people happy. climate change will be reversed/addressed (this might require/inspire international antagonism), and population control (executed via soft power in the AI-home nation) will assure plenty of resources to go ‘round. people won’t be thanking the AI that’s actually steering things, or even aware that it’s anything other than a classic existence. all public-facing ventures will feature a human figurehead who presents themselves as the key agent, but they’re really just following orders.

I think that’s it. the key point here is that there’s a unimpeded path from right now to “AI steers the course of human fate”, and there will never be a “pull the plug” moment. I talked through this with my girlfriend and she was like “well, are you REALLY in control of your destiny now?” and of course I’m not. we’re all bounded, and we’ll always be bounded. but the idea that AI could never define those bounds (which is how I felt before) now feels infinitely wrong. I'd be happy to hear refutations of the keys presumption...
Image
good thing I'll be dead soon, cause I'm tired of liars winning
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Sun Mar 31, 2019 12:02 pm

Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
featherboa
Olde Timer
Posts: 5542
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:17 pm

Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:26 am

cold blooded
let's overturn these tables disconnect these cables
This place don't make sense to me no more
copstache wrote: i cut my hand at work and just let it drip on my desk during a conference call
FVBTVS wrote:probably some punk broth
dames are lousy now mah i gotta bop peckahs
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:59 am

featherboa wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:26 am
cold blooded
i didnt mean it that way :lol: :lol: :lol:
Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Mon Apr 01, 2019 9:02 am

Necrometer wrote:
Thu Mar 28, 2019 12:14 pm

they can be death with readily.
:twisted:
Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
User avatar
Necrometer
crippled god of the universe
Posts: 61618
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 10:42 am
Location: Feelin' fine.
Contact:

Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:03 am

:shock:

if anyone thinks any of that is dumb or naive please say so. I'm feeling like nostradamus on this one (assuming he believed his own bullshit - no idea if he actually did!)
Image
good thing I'll be dead soon, cause I'm tired of liars winning
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:23 am

oh for crying out loud it isnt dumb!
Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
featherboa
Olde Timer
Posts: 5542
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:17 pm

Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:03 pm

I guess I agree with the outcomes, but don't think AI needs to be that smart/sentient (still skeptical it can ever be). It's already good enough for rich people to train to pick stocks, sell ads, influence society/elections/whatever and continue to increase their leverage in their project to eat the world.
let's overturn these tables disconnect these cables
This place don't make sense to me no more
copstache wrote: i cut my hand at work and just let it drip on my desk during a conference call
FVBTVS wrote:probably some punk broth
dames are lousy now mah i gotta bop peckahs
User avatar
Necrometer
crippled god of the universe
Posts: 61618
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 10:42 am
Location: Feelin' fine.
Contact:

Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:34 pm

:tup: thx humans

it's just very seldom that i'll go from "overblown concern" to "holy shit this is horrifying" so quickly
Image
good thing I'll be dead soon, cause I'm tired of liars winning
User avatar
Geeheeb
Shit Stadium 4000
Posts: 23365
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 9:18 am
Location: Lansing, MI
Contact:

Mon Apr 01, 2019 6:41 pm

i want AI to audit charts
FVBTVS wrote:
Tue Feb 06, 2018 12:04 pm
from enslavement to obliteration is older than abbey road
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:31 pm

Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:17 pm

Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
User avatar
cxwx
DO THE DEW!
Posts: 1510
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:17 pm
Location: The Venga Fat Bvs is Cumming

Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:42 pm

you’re not very good at seeing in the dark
User avatar
Necrophilic Mallard
Olde Timer
Posts: 5678
Joined: Mon Nov 05, 2007 7:13 pm
Location: Seattle

Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:08 am

Fact #7
From an empirical viewpoint, the problem with Free Will (and causality) is reconciling determinism and freedom to make sense of morality.
featherboa
Olde Timer
Posts: 5542
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:17 pm

Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:23 am

How about an AI for the hospital phone tree that connects you with the person you want to talk to?
let's overturn these tables disconnect these cables
This place don't make sense to me no more
copstache wrote: i cut my hand at work and just let it drip on my desk during a conference call
FVBTVS wrote:probably some punk broth
dames are lousy now mah i gotta bop peckahs
featherboa
Olde Timer
Posts: 5542
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:17 pm

Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:24 am

let's overturn these tables disconnect these cables
This place don't make sense to me no more
copstache wrote: i cut my hand at work and just let it drip on my desk during a conference call
FVBTVS wrote:probably some punk broth
dames are lousy now mah i gotta bop peckahs
featherboa
Olde Timer
Posts: 5542
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 9:17 pm

Tue Apr 02, 2019 10:26 am



If one schlub can do this with the only motivation being free lunch...
let's overturn these tables disconnect these cables
This place don't make sense to me no more
copstache wrote: i cut my hand at work and just let it drip on my desk during a conference call
FVBTVS wrote:probably some punk broth
dames are lousy now mah i gotta bop peckahs
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Sat Apr 06, 2019 11:23 am

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/04/03/ru ... ect-putin/

Russia Is Tricking GPS to Protect Putin

The Kremlin’s manipulation of global navigation systems is more extensive than previously understood.
Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
User avatar
cxwx
DO THE DEW!
Posts: 1510
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:17 pm
Location: The Venga Fat Bvs is Cumming

Sun Apr 21, 2019 10:40 pm

https://www.bing.com/amp/s/amp.islandpa ... 75549.html

Yale researchers restore low level synaptic function in a severed pigs head with blood substitute
you’re not very good at seeing in the dark
User avatar
hipster holocaust
Sweet Lord _______
Posts: 17741
Joined: Fri Aug 03, 2007 12:15 pm
Location: Fart og

Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:15 pm

You love bing
MeatGrease wrote:I think New Jersey has permanently fucked up my DNA
User avatar
FVBTVS
Sir Posts-A-Lot
Posts: 14445
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2013 2:14 pm

Wed Apr 24, 2019 1:05 pm

hipster holocaust wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 12:15 pm
You love bing
:lol:
Chad wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 4:01 pm
cool dudes like us
User avatar
cxwx
DO THE DEW!
Posts: 1510
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:17 pm
Location: The Venga Fat Bvs is Cumming

Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:26 pm

Image
you’re not very good at seeing in the dark
Jimm O' Lation
Methods for Attaining Extreme Altitudes
Posts: 220
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2010 9:26 am

Wed Apr 24, 2019 3:19 pm

oh god does he still think he's funny? I can't see his posts.
Post Reply