THREAD TO TALK ABOUT CULTURE WAR BULLSHIT

[spacehamster]

There’s no such thing as mansplaing, you stupid cum receptacles. It’s called details and making sure you understand as we are not actually in your rotten head. Imagine a proper instruction manual and not the trash from IKEA. Men talk to men like this too, jizz bucket.

… but it’s okay for you to repeat yourselves like a skipping record.

So you had an IKEA manual you couldn't understand and now you're pissed off and you're venting?

[cxwx]

Was it pisscubes who posted a picture of himself looking confused at some cryptic ikea instruction manual? I'm sure Zombiehead has it.

[spacehamster]

I've never understood this problem people have with IKEA manuals, but of course I've also been building Japanese model kits with no translation in the instructions for most of my life, so, you know.

[cxwx]

Just like a white man to pass his pain onto a black lesbian

[The Bill]

IKEA has good salmon.

[cxwx]

Can the resident bavarians confirm if this is a legitimate story?

[cxwx]

[The Bill]

The money being wasted on some fag cross walk is unbelievable. Is there no political party that tells religious jackasses to shut up and put a stop to liberal retardation?

Speaking of liberals and religion. What’s with them taking the side of such an anti-woman religion like Islam? You’re going to have to cover up that blue hair, and I don’t even want to think about how many trans would be stoned to death if Muslims got their way.

[FVBTVS]

The money being wasted on some fag cross walk is unbelievable. Is there no political party that tells religious jackasses to shut up and put a stop to liberal retardation?

Speaking of liberals and religion. What’s with them taking the side of such an anti-woman religion like Islam? You’re going to have to cover up that blue hair, and I don’t even want to think about how many trans would be stoned to death if Muslims got their way.

while id mostly prefer you contain your thoughts to your favorite video games, which i do actually value, i have to say i do kind of find this brand of 2012 era car dealership owning reactionary on facebook posting somewhat charming. its like the retro gaming version of culture war drivel. anything we should know about games journalism? just keep doing whatever this and dont upgrade to the new console

[postaddiction]

The point about far lefts championing homophobic misogynists is spot on for 2024 tho

[spacehamster]

The point about far lefts championing homophobic misogynists is spot on for 2024 tho

No.

[cxwx]

The money being wasted on some fag cross walk is unbelievable. Is there no political party that tells religious jackasses to shut up and put a stop to liberal retardation?

Speaking of liberals and religion. What’s with them taking the side of such an anti-woman religion like Islam? You’re going to have to cover up that blue hair, and I don’t even want to think about how many trans would be stoned to death if Muslims got their way.

while id mostly prefer you contain your thoughts to your favorite video games, which i do actually value, i have to say i do kind of find this brand of 2012 era car dealership owning reactionary on facebook posting somewhat charming. its like the retro gaming version of culture war drivel. anything we should know about games journalism? just keep doing whatever this and dont upgrade to the new console

I thought he was doing some gimmick, or just trying to bait people

[Whee of the Dead]

The point about far lefts championing homophobic misogynists is spot on for 2024 tho

This is another one of my favorite contemporary right wing talking points

"They stone gays and denigrate women... Something I wish we could do!!"

Also the reality that capitalism has shit in our fucking brains to the level that now we even view something like empathy as a transactional process. "There parents hate gays so lets ler the children burn."

If someone suggested a mass shooting was a-okay in an Alabama grade school cuz all there parents were homophobic christ pigs these same people would lose their minds.

[cxwx]

The head covering argument is stupid if the person isn't being forced to do it. No one uses that arguments to say that nuns are oppressed.

I don't support reasontv in any way shame or form, it was just the easiest link. I think getting 10 years for property damage with a hate crime enhancement is totally absurd. ( assuming it's accurate ) hate crimes are supposed to be things directed toward individuals, it wouldn't even be comparable to a hate crime enhancement for some who like smashed up a synagogue and spray painted 1488 and swastikas because the road is state property. I'm really curious if the incident in Germany is valid or not as I know they have very extreme anti defamation laws or maybe space hamster, the kill or moon man will correct me.

[FVBTVS]

Flatly saying No is so completely wrong but failing to recognize that predictable hard lefters are responding to a fucking active genocide by supporting tacitly.and explicitly the only material resistance to mass slaughter of women and children in the game. Thats what is happening. Anything other than that is utter fringe fakery and shadow puppetry that feels good to believe

This shit is such a mugs game

[FVBTVS]

Also like why ever pretend to care about violent homophobia and misogyny anywhere when you clearly don't either way. What is the tactical advantage you think you gain. Even rhetorically. Whats the debate

Its just us here; a bunch of xasthur fans with no power whatsoever! Why act like youre running for office

[spacehamster]

Can the resident bavarians confirm if this is a legitimate story?

Hamburg isn't in Bavaria and neither am I, but I googled it in German and did find a news report in a right-wing paper about it and a Neo-Nazi website that picked up the story, and it's more or less true, although the facts are being skewed a little here for outrage farming purposes.. 8 of the 10 men got probation, one got two years and nine months, one was acquitted. The woman who texted the one guy also threatened him, and she had a prior conviction for shoplifting. She got two days of youth detention. It's really not accurate to say that that's a "harsher sentence" than whatever amount of probation the 8 guys got. They did get off way too easy of course, but I also think two days of youth detention for someone with a prior conviction for threatening a stranger via text message isn't completely out there, and none of this proves that hate speech carries harsher sentences than gang rape.

[spacehamster]

This shit is such a mugs game

This is why I'm very content with just "no" as my answer. No, "the left" is not championing fundamentalist islam. This is not a thing that is happening.

[FVBTVS]

[cxwx]

Just to make my feelings crystal clear. I'd be happy if Hamas was wiped off the face of the earth, but the actions of the IDF are even worse.

[spacehamster]

Just to make my feelings crystal clear. I'd be happy if Hamas was wiped off the face of the earth, but the actions of the IDF are even worse.

These people literally can't process anything above the complexity level of a GI Joe cartoon. If you don't think the IDF should be doing war crimes in Gaza on a daily basis, that must mean you're pro Islamic fundamentalism. Also, if you think the Iraq invasion was illegal, you believe Saddam Hussein was innocent, and if you're against the Russian invasion of Ukraine, you're supporting literal Nazis.

I'm really not sure how to engage with people who are this fucking retarded.

[FVBTVS]

it's based when i do it and its bad when they do it

[cxwx]

The point about far lefts championing homophobic misogynists is spot on for 2024 tho

This is another one of my favorite contemporary right wing talking points

"They stone gays and denigrate women... Something I wish we could do!!"

Also the reality that capitalism has shit in our fucking brains to the level that now we even view something like empathy as a transactional process. "There parents hate gays so lets ler the children burn."

If someone suggested a mass shooting was a-okay in an Alabama grade school cuz all there parents were homophobic christ pigs these same people would lose their minds.

Cultural war horseshoe theory? Conservative Christian fundaments ban Christian iconography
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/rcna101585

[The Bill]

The money being wasted on some fag cross walk is unbelievable. Is there no political party that tells religious jackasses to shut up and put a stop to liberal retardation?

Speaking of liberals and religion. What’s with them taking the side of such an anti-woman religion like Islam? You’re going to have to cover up that blue hair, and I don’t even want to think about how many trans would be stoned to death if Muslims got their way.

while id mostly prefer you contain your thoughts to your favorite video games, which i do actually value, i have to say i do kind of find this brand of 2012 era car dealership owning reactionary on facebook posting somewhat charming. its like the retro gaming version of culture war drivel. anything we should know about games journalism? just keep doing whatever this and dont upgrade to the new console

I thought he was doing some gimmick, or just trying to bait people

James and I are a lot alike. And that’s all I’ll say. Perhaps I truly hate Muslims especially after actually learning about them in college combined with the radicals that killed Mike Turbo’s father during 9/11. Or perhaps I’m an alabaster skinned white dude whose ancestors are an eclectic bunch whom together formed me, Sun Burnered Voltron. And I married a Greek woman that takes me to her island where I can’t go out everyday and stays in the air conditioning, drinking because he’s bored. And he does so like to drunk post whatever nonsense purrs his car at that moment. Or maybe all of this is a damn lie!

[THE KILL]

Can the resident bavarians confirm if this is a legitimate story?

In case you want the details, here's an interview with the female judge that presided over the case.

====================================

Der Spiegel - 22 March 2024

On the night of September 20, 2020, after the end of the Corona lock-downs, around 100 young people celebrated on the fairground of Hamburg's city park. A 15-year-old girl was among them and drank more than usual. Later, she was in a state where she was only able to decide and express what she wanted and what she did to a very limited extent. Ten young men between the ages of 16 and 20 are said to have raped the girl independently of one another in different group constellations.

The trial against the men lasted one and a half years and was held behind closed doors. Over the course of the 68 days of trial, around 100 witnesses were heard. It ended on November 28, 2023: Nine men were sentenced between 12 months and 33 months for raping the girl. Four of the juvenile sentences imposed were suspended on probation with comprehensive sanctions and instructions for educational support. For four defendants, a decision on the execution of the juvenile sentences imposed is to be made six months after the judgment becomes final. One defendant is to be sent to youth prison for two years and nine months. One defendant was acquitted.

After the supposedly lenient verdict, hate comments, personal attacks, insults and threats rained down on those involved in the trial, especially on social media. There were also calls for violence against Judge Anne Meier-Göring, and for her or her relatives to become victims of rape themselves. This is the first time the judge has spoken out publicly.

SPIEGEL: After the verdict was announced, you and your court division were hit by a wave of outrage because the verdict was allegedly too lenient. Was it too lenient?

Meier-Göring: No, and you can tell that from the fact that the public prosecutor did not file an appeal. The victim, who was 15 at the time and appeared as a co-plaintiff in the trial, did not contest the verdict either. The police are also satisfied with the outcome of the case.

SPIEGEL: Nevertheless, there was a hail of criticism, you were bombarded with accusations, and on the internet some people called for harsher punishments for those convicted.

Meier-Göring: According to the German understanding of punishment, the primary goal of legal consequences are not retribution, but above all that the accused does not commit any new crimes. This is especially true in juvenile criminal law. We have based our decisions on this. If a trial and a verdict achieve this goal, it is the best protection for the victim and the best protection for the general public.

SPIEGEL: So what did the public misunderstand?

Meier-Göring: First of all: The proceedings were not public, and the court's explanatory statement of the verdict was primarily addressed to those involved in the proceedings, the defendants, the defense attorneys, the joint plaintiff and the public prosecutor. Therefore, only those involved in the proceedings know the whole truth. That is a good thing, because it protects the plaintiff in particular, who remembers almost nothing from the night of the crime. She should not be retraumatized by new information that becomes public. In the short public verdict announcement, I therefore left out many details - as in this interview - that also concerned the plaintiff's behavior and that were very crucial for the determination of legal consequences. Nevertheless: A verdict is passed "in the name of the people." That is why I have of course also asked myself again and again what I could have communicated better.

SPIEGEL: What was the misconception?

Meier-Göring: There was no brutal gang rape, such as those who commented on platform X probably imagined it. There was no incident in which nine young men "attacked" a young girl. There was no physical violence and no threats. And the co-plaintiff was not dragged into the bushes either.

SPIEGEL: What was it then if it wasn’t physical violence?

Meier-Göring: Physical violence wasn't necessary, because the co-plaintiff went with the respective groups of defendants. She even approached some of them on her own initiative. But the defendants took advantage of the co-plaintiff's severely mentally and physically impaired state on the night of the crime for their sexual acts. Such behavior would not have been punishable in Germany until November 2016, and everyone would have been acquitted. That is why what was reported in the "Bild" newspaper is so irresponsible and inflammatory: "Nine barbarians attack a young girl. With their orgy of violence, the rapists destroy a child's soul." That is deliberate spreading of fake news. It crosses a line and turns the general public against the justice system.

SPIEGEL: What are the men to blame for?

Meier-Göring: The defendants noticed the co-plaintiff's impaired condition and then exploited this in various group constellations for sexual intercourse without having ensured consent.

SPIEGEL: The perpetrators were punished with varying degrees of severity.

Meier-Göring: During the first set of offenses, the co-plaintiff was able to make it clear that she did not want the sexual acts to take place. This is one of the reasons why the first four defendants involved there received the harshest sentences. But they did not use violence or threats. In the following three sets of offenses, we were no longer able to determine whether it was clear that the sexual acts were carried out against the will of the co-plaintiff. One of the defendants - he was also the one who expressly wanted the trial to take place in public - was alone with the co-plaintiff during the sexual acts. Both had kissed before they went into the bushes. This defendant received the lowest sentence.

SPIEGEL: But we are already talking about rape?

Meier-Göring: According to the reformed sexual criminal law of 2016 [it was reformed because of this], there are a wide variety of forms of rape that do not have to involve physical violence or other forms of coercion. The term "rape" in the legal sense simply means that the sexual act must involve penetration of the body. This can be any orifice of a person's body, including the mouth. And penetration does not have to occur with a sexual organ. Even if the other person actively participates in the sexual acts, but is significantly limited in their ability to form their own will and/or express themselves, this can now constitute a criminal offense and possibly rape if the sexual act involves some kind of penetration of the body.

SPIEGEL: So the famous saying “Yes means yes” still applies?

Meier-Göring: No one can rely on a "yes" if there are doubts that this "yes" is really meant seriously. Therefore, if a potential perpetrator has such doubts - I said this in the explanation for the verdict - he must hold back. But above all, "no" means "no". Anyone who ignores this and still carries out sexual acts is committing a criminal offense. Since 2016, the new law has covered a huge variety of cases that can be punishable as rape. In my opinion, that is right. Anyone who violates another person's right to sexual self-determination must be held criminally responsible. However, this inevitably leads to a wider range of penalties. And often to considerable problems with proof.

SPIEGEL: What were those problems during the trial?

Meier-Göring: The strategy of the defendants and their defense attorneys was that the sexual acts were consensual. In the hearing of evidence, we therefore had to answer questions such as: How was the co-plaintiff? What was her condition? Could the defendants recognize that her sexual acts were against her will or that she was no longer able to decide? Did the co-plaintiff consent, and if so, shouldn't the perpetrators have asked themselves: Can she really be earnest in her current state?

SPIEGEL: The defense's argument was that no rape had taken place?

Meier-Göring: Exactly. Until the very end, the defense argued that the defendants were unable to determine the state of the co-plaintiff. They assumed that the co-plaintiff had consented to the sexual acts. That is why six defendants have appealed against the verdict. Critics of the new sexual offense law had previously said that such questions of evidence could not be resolved in a court hearing. In favor of the defendants, one must always assume that, in case of doubt, they did not sufficiently notice the victim's severely impaired state. However, our verdict shows that this is not true. Therefore, it is a real success in terms of the new sexual offense law. I wish that the press had communicated this important message of our verdict to the public more clearly.

SPIEGEL: You have imposed juvenile sentences on nine defendants. What does that mean?

Meier-Göring: The imposition of a juvenile sentence is the harshest sanction in juvenile criminal law. It is comparable to a prison sentence in adult criminal law and can only be imposed if so-called harmful tendencies or the severity of the guilt are established. Less harsh punishments include educational and disciplinary measures, such as writing an essay, work and fines, and arrest. But that was not considered because we saw a greater need for education among the accused, especially because they had not yet come to terms with their crime.

SPIEGEL: But only one of the defendants has to go to prison.

Meier-Göring: Yes, because in this case we assume that only a prison sentence will deter him from committing further crimes. In the case of the other eight defendants, however, we expect that they will remain crime-free even without serving a juvenile sentence. But for four defendants we want to examine this expectation more closely for six months. They have therefore been given what is known as preliminary probation. If they develop positively and finally start to deal with the crime, they do not have to go to prison. If their development is negative, then they do. This includes one defendant who we actually saw as almost the most individually guilty of the crime. But he has also worked on himself the most over the last three years, for example successfully completing inpatient drug therapy. During the trial, it was also clear how ashamed he was of his crime. Should we have put him in prison and ruined this positive development?

SPIEGEL: So you would prefer a lenient punishment?

Meier-Göring: It is wrong to believe that harsher penalties lead to fewer crimes. Young and adolescent offenders in particular act in the moment and do not think about the consequences of their actions. And certainly not about the punishments they will receive for them. Look at the USA. A western country with a much higher crime rate than ours. Yet they impose harsh penalties there and even have the death penalty.

[not mentioned by her in this interview: none of the defendants had a criminal history]